NEWSGROUPS FOR DRIVERS: SOUND OFF!
Instructions For Newsgroups File
MY 10 SELECTIONS
Selection #1
Oh no...watch out!
Other types to watch out for. (I'm not joking or trying to be funny) Women
(and some men) applying makeup or preening themselves in the mirror.
Anybody on the phone.
Anyone reading/eating/smoking while driving.
People with hands out the window.
Old men wearing hats.
Blue hair (or cars that appear to have no driver)
Mothers with children in front seat. (mini van)
Fathers with children in front seat.
Taxis
Diplomats
Car poolers
Actually the worst I have found are men in suits driving expensive sports
sedans. Most of the group you listed can kill you due to not paying attention,
but other than running over you at a stop they tend to drift rather than make
abrupt moves. OTOH, these arrogant bastards, who obviously own the road, tend
to drive very aggressively and make abrupt lane changes. They also will
deliberately cut you off or force
you off the road.
Making the assumption that no one can see you will keep you safe from the
clueless, but won't save you from those who are deliberately aggressive. [ bj ]
My Comments:
This driver (bj) is trying to tell everyone what type of people to watch out
for while driving on the road. Some of the types that he has mentioned is
sort of ridiculous but many of it are true. The ones that I've hadproblems
with the most are old men wearing hats and people on the phone. For those on
the phone, I think that it's due to the lack of attention. Also it mat be
due to the inability coordinate both hands. As for the old men wearing hats,
that is a phenomenon that I can't explain. The only assumption I can come up
with is old age. But I swear, they are bad drivers (changing lanes without
looking first)! It's so funny because this is not the first time I have
heard about these types of people. The particular individual that wrote
this commentary seems to have come to these conclusions through self
witnessing. BJ wants to warn others of what he has come across on the road.
It doesn't seem that he is angry or upset but rather I get the feeling that
he just wants to share his experience with everyone.
Selection #2
Cyclist's Road Rage
How do you all deal with road rage? Since Labor Day, I have found traffic to be atrocious. Things that really 'irk' me are taxi drivers doing a U-turn right in front of me or cars that have a yellow blinking light at circles that pop out right in front of me even though I have the right of way. I wish I could slap a sticker right on their windshield that says "I am on the road too". After reading the thread on the cyclist who murdered the woman, it got me thinking. I don't condone at all what he did, but I can empathize with at least a fraction of the frustration he may have felt. Sometimes I want to get off my bike and confront the person who almost hit me by their inconsiderateness. Sometimes when I get to work, I am seething with frustration. I don't like it that these small things get to me so much... so how do you all deal with road rage?
I commute every day by bike and understand your feelings. But don't give into road rage. Concentrate on good cycling. I ride in DC and I am convinced that most of the Metrobus drivers, many of the taxi drivers and a good number of the car drivers would be happy to see cyclists crashed on the side of the road. Many of them see us as just one more traffic problem and many are frustrated at the many problems driving a car entails. I ride very defensively, wait until all the cars at an intersection have run a red light, expect to be cut off by buses and cabs, and generally expect most auto drivers not to see me or to force their way in front of me if they see the need to. Do I get pissed when they do those dumb things? Of course. But I have gradually learned that yelling at a bus that just cut me off is fruitless and explaining to drivers I have caught up with at an intersection that they just about killed me is a waste of time. I try to concentrate on cycling well and safely. In DC I can generally stay up with or ahead of most car traffic, which makes me feel good. And even given all the negatives, I still find cycling an exhilarating experience. I no longer have a car and there is no way I would ever go back to driving one.
[ B. Kline ]
My Comments:
I am one who is guilty for thinking that only cars and trucks should be on
the road. These cyclists is trying to tell us that they also have the right
to be on the road. However they are at the disadvantage because they are
much smaller than cars and trucks. Therefore they are more prone to get
pushed around and ignored. The first commentary by K. Downing has
experienced frustration and anger due to the lack of consideration people
have on the road. She realizes that she is a potential risk for road rage
and so she is asking for help. I'm glad the second commentary by B. Kline
was very rational. He has given K. Downing good advice because he
understands that road rage is not the key to anything.
Selection #3
Prescription: One Cigar per Commute
This week my ex-wife is outta town. I have to take my kids to two different
schools and then myself to work. I live 'out of town' so it's a two hour trek.
This morning while the people in cars next to me were showing signs of severe
stress from the traffic, I was puffin a Monte #2 listening to Gatemouth Brown
with a big band, "Gatemouth Swings". It's great swing music, I hated it when
the traffic cleared.
Leonard 'c'mon light get stuck on red :-)'
Leonard, you're exactly right. This is what made me become a serious cigar
smoker. My commute used to be an easy 20 minute ride that has now turned into
a 50 minute commute from hell. One day I was full of road rage and saw a guy
in the car next to me just puffing along without a care in the world. Tried it
myself and it was like a transformation. So now I light up going to work and
coming home. It's made my life sane again.
Now if I could just find an excuse for all the rest of the cigars I smoke when
I'm not driving I'd be in good shape!
My Comments:
A lot of my friends don't wish to quite smoking because they say it relaxes
them. I always wondered if it was physically true or all psychological.
Commuting in heavy traffic is a real drag and it does bring my stress level
up. However I don't think that I want to start up smoking a cigar because I
can't stand the smell. This driver is trying to give us a solution that may
help make commuting more pleasurable. Good Luck to those who try it out.
Selection #4
Leave Your Car at Home
S. Geller wrote:
Try replacing the "control freak" with a reasonable person or committee. I
think it's clear who uses a car for performing work and who uses it just to
commute. If you're hauling stuff to do with your work, then you need the
car. If you're driving an otherwise empty car to get to work; you
don't, unless your work is inaccessible by transit.
Search every vehicle?
Best bet is to let each individual decide. If
the going gets rough, they'll change, move or give-up. Fine with me. But are
you willing to put any squeeze on the drivers to cut down on cars? When the
going gets really tough, the weak will move away--or find
a solution. Hopefully, trucks, vans and other vehicles too.
After a very lengthy commute that lasted three and one-half years, I have now
decided to work only within a 6 mile radius of home. Life is better because of
it. Staggered work hours and telecommuting are other possible solutions.
My Comments:
This person is pointing out that unless you need your car for hauling your
work around, you shouldn't be driving you car to work. I can see that this
person is trying to encourage carpool and mass transit to alleviate traffic.
I think the reason why people drive their own car to work is because of
flexibility. When you share a car with others or using the mass transit, you
are in their time not your own. This makes it difficult to do things that
you want to do before or after work. Apparently he doesn't have much errands
or other duties besides work. I know he was only trying to help.
Selection #5
Drivers: It's Snowing
Most of you are going to think these are pretty stupid questions, but I'm
really curious: What's it like to drive in snow?
It's more of an inconvenience than anything else. Speeds drop, at least for
the intelligent drivers.
I lived in Hawaii all my life, and I've never
*really* seen snow. I've been to the mainland in winter, but the closest thing
I've seen was a lot of slushy ice and cold water on the ground -- and that was
in the 9th grade. Just how slippery is snow? I've seen cars on TV sliding at
less than 1 ft/sec. Does that happen often? I just can't believe it's always
that bad -- no one would drive. If it's not usually that bad, what's
typical?
As others have said, it depends on the snow. Black ice is the absolute worst,
and if you hit it, you just hope you're going in a straight line. Snow usually
comes when the temperature is just a bit below freezing. We often get a
snowstorm, followed by much colder weather; the snow and water freeze making
things more treacherous. Studded tires are outlawed in most places because of
damage to roads. Most snowy roads are not difficult to drive on, but speeds
have to be reduced. I've driven in ice storms, with 2 wheels on the
shoulder just to give me a bit of traction -- I made it, and I've seen
plenty of cars in the ditches. It's just common sense. Bridges can be
dangerous because they often tend to ice up, even when there's no ice
elsewhere on the roads.
How thick does the snow have to be before people don't drive? And when the
snow is that thick (or thicker), how do people get around? How often does that
happen? Most cities that are accustomed to snow have the equipment to
deal with it efficiently. Teams of trucks go out with plows. Main streets and
divided highways are cleared first, and neighborhood streets last. Plows just
push the snow to the sides, and usually a day or 2 after the storm, dump
trucks and front-end loaders or other specialized equipment clear it away.
Snow doesn't stop many people. For the winter, I keep a blanket, wool jacket,
small shovel, extra windshield washer fluid, candles, bungee cords and an
emergency kit in the trunk. I also have a folding metal traction pad that you
simply unfold and place under the drive wheels if you're stuck; it works like
a charm.
If there's a steep hill near where you live, how do you get to your house during the winter? It's usually not a problem, unless you get icy conditions.
How fast do people drive on the Interstate when
it's snowing? What's it like, driving on the Interstate during winter? On the
400-series of roads, traffic just slows down. The limits are 100 kph (60 mph),
which is too low for good weather. Under poor conditions, most people just
slow down. I can feel where my traction starts to slip, and I just lower the
speed. It's the old rule, drive to conditions.
Another problem with wet snow is the dirty slush that keeps getting sprayed
onto your windshield. You need lots of windshield washer fluid! Most people
also have lock de-icer, just in case their key won't turn in the door after
it's been sitting outside for some time.
In this city and further north, you'll find a lot of people with inline (in
the heating system tubing) or block heaters. If cars are left outside, people
often plug in their cars. Further north, you'll find parking lots with posts
in front of each space, for car plug-ins.
Do you have to use different tires during the winter than the summer? Tires
with some kind of metal on them? How effective are "All-Season" tires in the
snow? I use all-seasons, but I'd prefer to have winter tires for
winter driving (on all 4 tires is best). Cost is a factor. Front-wheel drive
cars are better in the snow, since the weight of the engine is on the front
drive axle, helping with traction.
How effective are traction control, 4WD, and ABS in the snow? I know full well
how well these work in heavy rain, and I'm sure they help in the snow -- but
how much? 'Day and Night' or not much difference? Many people who commute into
the city will have those damn sport utility vehicles with 4WD. It's certainly
a great help in heavy snowfall conditions.
From what I've seen on TV, it looks like winter driving is dangerous for most
people, but if you know what you're doing, it could be fun. Is that about
right? Or is it just scary for everyone? It can be fun if you want to go into
a car parking lot and pull a few doughnuts. Apart from that, it's inconvenient
since you have to slow down and travel time increases. I never hesitate to
drive in snow, but I'll hesitate if it's icy out.
My Comments:
This person is asking a very logical question because there is no snow in
Hawaii, well except for Mauna Kea. The people who responded to her questions
was very civilized. They didn't make fun or made such a big deal about the
person not knowing about snow. It shows that there are people out there who
wishes not to remain ignorantly. As one can see there were many respondents
who responded to the question. This really shows that there are people out
there who are willing to share their experiences and knowledge. All you got
to do is ask.
Selection #6
Support through Newsgroups
I am so sick of aggressive drivers swerving around me and tailgating me! I am
a responsible, alert driver, and if I weren't so alert, I'd probably have
racked up thousands in med bills from the could-have-been accidents. I live
near Washington DC - people drive like NY here. I am NOT a 20 mph
I also live down here- and I also went the UMCP and have probably been on the
same roads as you have and at about the same time so I probably have the best
idea of what you're talking about. driver in a 40mph zone - I am NOT
contributing to other driver's frustration except that I'm not speeding and
being reckless like them.
This isn't necessarily your fault- the 55 mph speed limit on the beltway
is obsolete. In light to moderate traffic, unless you are going 75+ I suggest
you keep as right as possible. Sure those other people are "breaking the law"-
but keeping the speed limit artificially low around here has created contempt
for the law- blame the state for this... If they pick a reasonable number and
then try to enforce it conditions will improve.
This morning I almost got hit several times while inching along in traffic and
the woman behind me was hugging my rear. Whenever I had to apply my brakes, I
saw her curse and swear at me as her car bowed down from slamming on the
brakes.
There is two things that could be wrong in this picture:
1) the person behind you could have a serious physical/psychological ailment.
In my 10 years of driving I have had 1 person have an epileptic seizure while
driving in the car behind me, and another had what seems be a nervous
breakdown and just went insane driving up her car on the lawn and start
cursing at people who weren't even near her car or IN a car. This kinda shit
happens.
2) Your driving skills may not be compatible with traffic conditions on
495/95. If you are driving in bumper to bumper traffic here and you are giving
the car in front of you 8 car lengths of space then I'd be cursing you too
because a million cars would be cutting in front of YOU while at the same time
tripling my commute time by you starting a wave of rubber necking.
It was really obnoxious. I've noticed there's an attorney on the group - does
he or anyone know if a citizen can file an anonymous complaint in these cases?
I don't want some crazy knowing where I live and stalking me, so anonymity is
a real plus. This could be bad, but then again it could be a blessing- someone
could be reporting you right now for obstructing traffic.
Thanks for listening to me vent. Let me know what you think. Maybe I can rig
up some sort of alarm or light system. I knew someone who set up a headlight
in their rear and would flick it on whenever someone had their high beams on
behind them.
This would not be good- from reading this and the rest of your message it
would appear that you have some built in resentment for the drivers behind you
and you feel they should accept you the way you are because you think you are
a safe driver.
I strongly suggest you get yourself a book on stress management and diffuse
this before you attempt to further agitate drivers behind you- this could lead
into a situation of confrontation and you can get yourself injured or killed
considering how much pressure is built up in the had of the driver behind
you.
FWIW: I've been driving down here for 6 years. Regarding people
tailgating me/flashing me/etc... I have very rarely been tailgated to the
point of being really pissed off I'd say... probably one or two dozen times).
Your post is very similar to another one on DC.DRIVING a few months ago from
a driver who complained about how bad DC/Metro drivers are and how every
couple of weeks someone literally tries to run him off the road, but when he
posted details of his driving habits you can almost see why someone would try
to run him off the road.
My Comments:
Everyone needs to vent once in a while. Venting through newsgroups is an
alternative to venting to one's loved one. It's great. The respondents
showed a lot of compassion and support towards the person. The pros and cons
regarding the advice on filing a complaint on aggressive drivers really
showed that people are thinking about the subject. It also shows that they
care and want to make the person feel better. To me this is wonderful
because they don't even know each other face to face but are able to still
give support.
Selection #7
We Need to Get Along
Christ, how hard is it? If people are tailgating you, you are going to slow
FOR THE LANE YOU ARE IN! Move over! If you want to drive at the legal limit,
you had better be to the right as far as possible. The left lane is the fast
lane. The right lane is the slow lane. Any lanes in between are very loosely
defined, but generally they travel faster the farther left they are. If you
are afraid you might get a ticket, and want to go exactly the limit, fine.
Just get over to the right! Going slow in the left lane and not allowing
faster drivers by because you're angry at them for tailgating you is both
dangerous and pompous. Go ahead and drive
55. Just don't expect others to do the same. So get out of the way, this is
the '90s, gas is cheap and cars are fun again.
C. Scott
On Sun, 27 Sep 1998, asdf wrote:
Oh man, you hit the point right on the spot.
Sometimes I wish I drove a big American truck with a huge iron front bumper
covered in foam so I can actually push the slow punk in front of me. Sometimes
I wish I could mount a shotgun to my rear bumper so I could put a 12 gauge
slug into the tailgaters engine. The people who think they have a right to
drive 55 in the fast lane on a 65 mph freeway are not only stupid but are also
the causes of accidents.
A CHP officer has A LEGAL RIGHT to ticket me if I go past the speed limit.
The fast lane on the freeway is a misnomer because LEGALLY all lanes have the
same limit. If I was doing 50 to 40 mph in a 65 MPH then I EXPECT the CHP
officer to ticket me for obstructing traffic. I usually drive at the limit or
5 - 10 miles faster and 90 % of the time I drive on the number 3 lane because
CHP officers are trained to concentrate on the #1 or the "fast lane" to catch
the speeders. I guess that is why I have not gotten a moving violation in the
last 10 years. If I happen to get behind someone that is obstructing traffic I
calmly set my blinker and pass him I don't try to force the 90 year old
grandmother, who can barely control her bowel movements to try to control a
5000 Lb Cadillac at 100 MPH. yes, I agree she probably should not be driving
in the first place, but that is another topic to rant about.
If you're on the fast lane and someone's
tailgating you, then you probably should yield because you're going too slow.
going too slow for who? not for the person driving and not for the
legal system that posted the limit people who tailgate cause accidents if the
guy in front needs to stop. and if YOUR impatience causes YOU to weave in and
out of traffic without signaling or checking over your shoulder YOU are the
greater danger.
Loren Harrington wrote:
The main principle of the matter is that speed limits are there to
create standardization. no speed limit and you've got people going
moderate speeds, slow speeds, fast speeds, all trying to pass each other.
That's pretty dangerous.. speed limits usually are set so a car, that meets
minimum safety standards, can drive on the road at the posted speed limit on a
wet road and not risk lossing control. minimum standards are probably a YUGO
with 115.70.R13 tires
All I gotta say is, if you're driving the speed limit or less, get on the right and let people like me pass. pleeeeease. If you are courteous and politely flash your lights at me I will. but if you are a A$#@$ and start riding my tail I will slow 1 MPH for every 3 feet closer you get :P
My Comments:
This is why we can't get along on the road. Everyone thinks that they have
the right of way and are never wrong. In this posting there are exchanges in
beliefs of how to drive, again the I am right attitude. No one really wants
to hear the other person out. It's ignorance and inconsiderate. People
should try to communicate effectively. It is not who had the loudest voice
or the best come back line, it's who can bring on a solution to the
problem.
Selection #8
Distractions, Distractions
Well, like I said, I don't HAVE a cell phone anymore, so it's ceased
to even BE a distraction. Of course, more pedestrian distractions in
automobiles could be such things as changing the radio station, disciplining
the kids or even talking to a passenger. Like using a cell phone in a car,
they all require a modicum of common sense to accomplish while driving. Of
course, I'm sure you NEVER change the radio station while you're driving ;)
Actually, I don't change the radio station. I found a station I like and have
had it there for years -- and I keep the sound low enough so that I can still
hear. But I agree that it is important to minimize all distractions. I
spend most of my driving time in high speed, bumper to bumper freeway traffic
-- and way too many crazy drivers -- and several poorly designed
intersections (it is not uncommon to see 2 or 3 accidents a week at these
intersections.) As a result, I force myself to keep all my attention on the
road -- something that has saved me from being an innocent victim of an
accident.
My Comments:
Indeed cellular phones, changing the radio station, disciplining kids are
all distractions. However, I don't think it is the object that increases the
risk of an accident but rather it's the persons actions. If one knows how to
use a cellular phone, for example memorizing the buttons, there will be no
problem. The same goes for the changing of the radio station. I got mine
memorized so I just keep my eye on the road and my hands automatically knows
what buttons to press. I don't know about the older car but what really was
helpful is the preprogrammed buttons, it's such a life saver. As for the
kids, well parents should condition their children by using different tones
of the voice.
Selection #9
Air Bags Saves Lives
Young, inexperienced, and possibly drunk, drivers are more likely to have
serious accidents, but airbags will not solve that problem. Some of those
problems are social, and require ongoing programs to educate the public and
catch persistent offenders. NZ now has high levels of compliance for seat belt
usage, and has greatly reduced drink driving - after a massive mixed campaign
involving random stopping and breath testing combined with public
education that people should not allow drunk drivers to get into cars.
Initially, there was a huge outcry about random stopping ( previously the
police had to have a reason to stop a car - such as erratic driving or some
other offence - and complaints about establishing checkpoints outside of pubs
and clubs engendered public sympathy. Now most of the public accept that
police can install roadblocks and check all drivers traveling along the
highway, because they know they are safer if drunk drivers are taken off the
road.
There are no easy answers to reducing the tragedy of road carnage, but airbags
will evolve, just like seatbelts have, to protect occupants. I criticize NHTSA
for failing to listen to experts, preferring instead to listen to vocal lobby
groups - who have never apologized for their erroneous advice, and for taking
too long to respond to the data showing that there was a problem that needed
immediate attention.
Airbags still save many more lives than they take, and there will always be
some tradeoff of between social and financial cost and benefit, but that has
always been the case for safety devices. I would still prefer to be in an
airbag-equipped car, whether the airbag was first, second, or third (
so-called "smart" airbags ), generation, and whether it was a US or or
European specification airbag. I would be wearing my seatbelt, and I would be
sitting well back in the seat, as experts have shown that my chances
of surviving my own, or somebody else's mistake, are greatly improved. [ B.
Hamilton ]
My Comments:
I have heard so many comments about air bags both positive and negative. I
don't think that it should be required like seat belts. Seat belts have been
proven to save lives, not add to the injury. However air bags have been
known to accidentally kill. I think that the need for air bags in the car
should be of personal choice. I know someone who is very adamant about not
having an airbag in her car. She refuses to get a car with one because she
said that since she is petite the air bag is going to smother her. Indeed
their should be an improvement of air bags. This will maybe help encourage
drivers to get air bags. But again, it should be up to the person to
decide.
Selection #10
Driver's Education
Dear People:
I guess I don't understand the question. When I was a kid most students were
taught to drive by their fathers. Driver's education took up
valuable education time. Also, it takes a big investment in time to teach
a teenager to drive. In driver's ed, you can work out the math but each
kid spends little time behind the wheel. Much better is a parent letting
his kid take the wheel and then critique him often.
It doesn't take long to teach a student the basics of driving (it is
easier than riding a bicycle, for example.) The real problem is learning
the little things we take for granted. This takes time and explains why
old people who can barely see over the wheel can somehow get around with
fewer accidents than teenagers with all their facilities.
Steve Moore wrote in message ...
Texas has recently passed legislation that allows parents to teach
drivers education to their own children. Has anyone attempted this yet? I
have the materials and the requirements, but I would like to hear from someone
who has completed it.
[ Steve º ]
My Comments:
I do not agree with this person. At times parents are unable to teach their
children to drive due to nervousness. I remember when my mother thought me how
to drive we would get into big arguments. It was so hard for me to learn from
her because she was not a very good teacher. At times teens learn better from
someone besides their parents, someone who was trained for teaching. This
reduces the nervousness and of course the silent treatment home.
Suggestions For Future Generations
Hey future generations! Although starting on your reports EARLY will help you
tremendously, most of you will probably like me and wait until the last
minute! Let me warn you, it is a lot of work and you will be stressed! But you
know what? You can do it and you'll learn so much from it! Just DON'T GIVE UP
it's not worth getting a bad grade. One thing that I found to be very
helpful...get to know your CLASSMATES, my classmates helped me a whole lot!
My Report Compared To Others In My Class
I'm sure that everyone in the class will have done a great job on this
project. However, a lot of us procrastinated and so we couldn't look at each
others Newsgroups files to see what was done.. Oh the pressure! I think that I
did a pretty good job! This report was very long and time consuming so I just
want to say that I'm proud of everyone who stuck through and finished it!
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